00:00 eli: stamourv: A reminder here is as good as one there.
00:01 adu: reminder?
00:01 adu: right, scrollback
00:01 adu: heh
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00:11 dyoo: eli: cleaning up the bug tracker?  I'm getting a lot of automated messages re: attributing responsibility
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00:20 eli: dyoo: Yes, already done.
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00:20 dyoo: ok, cool.
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00:23 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/CwE-lg
00:23 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 46894e0 Eli Barzilay: Improve comment.
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03:30 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/M1CCjw
03:30 RacketCommitBot: racket/master bbd0693 Eli Barzilay: New Racket version 5.3.3.4.
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03:56 lewis1711: there was an article about doing a text adventure game in racket. or making a text adventure DSL. artcile is down though
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04:38 cnonim: where i can found article about intermedia representation of racket?
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09:30 asumu: lewis1711: http://queue.acm.org/detail.cfm?id=2068896
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09:40 notdan: Is there any way to use pattern matching in let?
09:40 notdan: For example, if (f) returns a list, I want to do something like (let ([(h t) (f)]) ..)
09:41 notdan: oh, there is match-let.. nvm
09:41 notdan: sorry
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10:32 mithos28: stamourv: ping
10:32 stamourv: mithos28: pong
10:32 mithos28: So I have a mostly working version of what we talked about yesterday
10:32 stamourv: You're in early.
10:32 stamourv: Cool!
10:33 mithos28: I get up as soon as the sun streams in
10:33 stamourv: I wish I was able to do that. :)
10:33 mithos28: so the issue is annotations, should (ann (+ 1.0 2.0) Any) be optimized?
10:34 stamourv: I would say yes.
10:34 mithos28: Because that would require putting something other than Any in the type table for that expression
10:35 stamourv: Well, since, IIUC, we compute the precise type, we could be putting it in the type table. Right?
10:35 mithos28: Right, my change currently does put the precise type in the type table.
10:35 mithos28: But this breaks some of the missed optimization tests
10:36 mithos28: because they assume it won't be there
10:36 mithos28: so the question is: is an annotation different from an expected type?
10:38 stamourv: Then that's probably a bug in the tests.
10:38 stamourv: Or rather, I wrote the tests in a brittle way.
10:38 stamourv: Do you know which tests break?
10:38 mithos28: ok, the comments in the tests imply that you expected that annotation to make the optimization not fire
10:39 mithos28: pair.rkt, fixnum.rkt and another
10:39 stamourv: Having a look now.
10:40 mithos28: for pair, it is lines: 16,18,25,27
10:40 mithos28: fixnum is line 40
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10:43 stamourv: Right. For these tests, I'm using annotations as a quick way to simulate loss of type precision. Changing them to use `define:'d values, or function arguments, should work.
10:44 mithos28: ok, I'm changing them to (values (ann <expr> <type>))
10:44 stamourv: So yeah, the tests are broken, and your patch is correct.
10:44 stamourv: Even better.
10:44 mithos28: also the optimizer error messages need a bit of work
10:45 stamourv: In the expected logs?
10:45 mithos28: yeah
10:45 stamourv: These are not really error messages.
10:45 stamourv: At this point, they're only used for testing.
10:45 stamourv: Optimization Coach is the preferred interface.
10:45 mithos28: no, I mean the test case output
10:46 mithos28: of actual vs expected
10:46 stamourv: Oh, I see what you mean. Yes, I agree.
10:46 stamourv: It's a bit of a pain to find the exact problem.
10:46 stamourv: And it's gotten worse with named loggers that prefix the messages with their names.
10:47 stamourv: Sadly, I don't know of a better way.
10:47 stamourv: I'm sure we could improve it in small ways, but I don't think we can do drastically better.
10:47 mithos28: I was thinking of having each line as a string instead of a bunch of tokens
10:48 stamourv: Robby, eli and I thought about testing strategies for the optimizer for a while, and that's the best we could come up with.
10:48 mithos28: then at least it would look like what is in the file and the output
10:48 stamourv: Re strings: sure, that would be an improvement.
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10:49 stamourv: If you want to give it a try, that would be great.
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10:49 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/gla6QA
10:49 RacketCommitBot: racket/master ca95129 Matthew Flatt: JIT: inline `char->integer' and `integer->char'
10:49 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 8f96060 Matthew Flatt: racket/draw win32: work around a Pango bug...
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12:12 asumu: :o there is an animated-gif library!?
12:13 asumu: rudybot: (require racket/draw mrlib/gif)
12:13 rudybot: asumu: your sandbox is ready
12:13 rudybot: asumu: error: file-or-directory-modify-seconds: `read' access denied for /home/erich/.racket/racket-prefs.rktd
12:13 asumu: Erm.
12:13 asumu: rudybot: (require racket/draw)
12:13 rudybot: asumu: Done.
12:13 asumu: rudybot: (require mrlib/gif)
12:13 rudybot: asumu: Done.
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12:14 asumu: rudybot: init racket
12:14 rudybot: asumu: your sandbox is ready
12:14 asumu: rudybot: (require mrlib/gif)
12:14 rudybot: asumu: error: file-or-directory-modify-seconds: `read' access denied for /home/erich/.racket/racket-prefs.rktd
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12:27 dca: hi
12:28 dca: what data structure should i use for storing pixels with w/regard to this call:
12:28 dca: http://docs.racket-lang.org/draw/bitmap-dc_.html#(meth._(((lib._racket%2Fdraw..rkt)._bitmap-dc~25)._set-argb-pixels))
12:28 dca: ?
12:28 dca: byte strings ?
12:29 mithos28: isn't that what the documentation says
12:29 mithos28: pixels : bytes?
12:35 stamourv: dca: `bytes?' = byte strings. The predicate's name is not as descriptive as it could be.
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12:38 dyoo: asumu: re the animated gif stuff.   I worked to implement the improved octree quantization described in http://docs.racket-lang.org/file/gif.html?q=quantize#%28def._%28%28lib._file%2Fgif..rkt%29._quantize%29%29
12:38 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/akxsjpl
12:40 asumu: dyoo: nice. :D
12:42 dyoo: dca: see http://docs.racket-lang.org/guide/bytestrings.html for an intro to bytes
12:42 dyoo: and see http://docs.racket-lang.org/reference/bytestrings.html for more detailed information on the bytes data structure
12:51 dca: thanks
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13:14 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/Hoyn-w
13:14 RacketCommitBot: racket/master e99fcf6 Matthew Flatt: add ackn
13:14 RacketCommitBot: racket/master e0650c4 Matthew Flatt: JIT: fix for 32-bit mode...
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14:45 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/ciJ95Q
14:45 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 796550b Danny Yoo: Add example of mixin form to guide documentation....
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14:53 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/BK-xQw
14:53 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 164a583 Robby Findler: use impersonator-ephemeron to allow a...
14:53 RacketCommitBot: racket/master d3e1c16 Robby Findler: adjust the c:x;n and c:x;p keybindings to use the...
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15:12 dyoo: anyone know where I can find docs for 5.2.1 online?
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15:32 dyoo: followup: found at http://download.racket-lang.org/docs/
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15:36 asumu: dyoo: is that linked from anywhere?
15:36 asumu couldn't find it
15:36 dyoo: ok, good, it's not just me then.
15:36 dyoo: it's completely unfindable.  :)
15:37 dyoo: I'm proposing adding a link to the sidebar on the main docs page.
15:37 dyoo: https://github.com/dyoo/racket/commit/87a5280b13f7092f730145028fcbdea8a8cc5519
15:37 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/a2gs8ah
15:37 asumu: Sounds good to me
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15:40 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/srM1ZA
15:40 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 87a5280 Danny Yoo: Adding link to prior versions of the docs.
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16:08 zNowkid: hi. can anyone help me with a problem? I just started using racket and I have some problems. I keep getting blue screens and I don't know exactly what to do. It may be something with the memory but I'm not sure
16:18 asumu: zNowkid: Blue screens on Windows? Does it happen with any other programs?
16:18 asumu: Also are you doing anything in particular?
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16:21 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 3 new commits to master: http://git.io/MzoBdg
16:21 RacketCommitBot: racket/master c9c4d33 Matthew Flatt: scribble/sigplan: add `subtitle'...
16:21 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 8ef5e88 Matthew Flatt: another JIT repair
16:21 RacketCommitBot: racket/master ce96075 Matthew Flatt: scribble: fix 'aux stripping for hyperlinks and HTML titles
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16:32 asumu: Is a contract (and/c (listof foo?) pair?) always equivalent to (non-empty-listof foo?)?
16:33 stamourv: I'd assume so.
16:34 asumu couldn't think of a counterexample
16:34 zNowkid: only in racket I have this problem.
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16:36 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 3 new commits to master: http://git.io/Q6atYg
16:36 RacketCommitBot: racket/master ea0c14d Asumu Takikawa: Rackety
16:36 RacketCommitBot: racket/master db4a163 Asumu Takikawa: Minor doc fixes
16:36 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 5e37134 Asumu Takikawa: Index some info.rkt fields for raco setup
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16:37 asumu: zNowkid: is there anything in particular that you're doing in Racket that leads to a blue screen?
16:39 zNowkid: nothing that I could think of. I'm doing simple examples like fibonacci, list problems( sorting, reverse etc.)
16:40 stamourv: zNowkid: Is this in Racket, or in DrRacket?
16:40 zNowkid: DrRacket
16:41 stamourv: Which version?
16:43 zNowkid: v5.3.3
16:45 stamourv: I would recommend filing a bug report. Sadly, it looks like there's not much information to guide a diagnosis.
16:45 stamourv: IIRC (haven't used Windows in a while), blue screens don't give stack traces.
16:46 asumu: (make sure to use DrRacket's bug report form so it'll record your system info)
16:48 zNowkid: I will do that. And I will try another version to see if there are any improvements on this problem.
16:49 zNowkid: Thank you asumu and stamourv
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16:51 cored: hello
16:53 zNowkid: and while I'm here. I want to remove n elements from a list ( from the beginnig ). example : '(1 2 3 4 5) 3 -> '(4 5); What am I missing?         (append (cdr L) (drop (cdr L) (- n 1)))
16:53 (quit) vipjun: Quit: Leaving.
16:54 stamourv: zNowkid: Why are you using `append'? `drop' should do the trick.
16:54 stamourv: rudybot: (drop '(1 2 3 4 5) 3)
16:54 rudybot: stamourv: your sandbox is ready
16:54 rudybot: stamourv: ; Value: (4 5)
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17:02 zNowkid_: about the drop function, I'm trying to define it by my own( already did for take)
17:04 stamourv: Ah, I see.
17:05 stamourv: Are you following a book, or just learning on your own?
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17:05 stamourv: If you want a book, I recommend HTDP.
17:10 zNowkid_: Thank you. I'm just started like 3 days ago. This is one of the languages I'm learning this semester
17:12 zNowkid_: Could you give me a hint in what am I doing wrong? this is what I'm trying to do (drop '(1 2 3 4 5) 4) , but I get '((2 3 4 5) (3 4 5) (4 5) (5))
17:13 zNowkid_: the correct output should be (5)
17:14 didi: zNowkid_: You probably shouldn't use `drop' to define your own drop.
17:15 dyoo: zNowkid: let me contradict didi.  :)  Your recursive definition of drop should use itself.  I'm guessing that your definition isn't correct, and that's why you're seeing weird output from the function.
17:15 zNowkid_: I had no problem when I used "take"
17:15 didi: Oh, I meant Racket's `drop'.
17:16 dyoo: zNowkid_: Offhand, would strongly recommend making sure you've got simple cases working.  What happens with (drop '(1 2 3 4 5) 0), for example?
17:17 dyoo: You should encode explicit test cases.  See: http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/matthias/HtDP2e/part_one.html#(part._sec~3atesting)
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17:18 dyoo: zNowkid_: the other case you want to consider: (drop '(1 2 3 4 5) 1)
17:19 dyoo: You _know_ what the answer should be here, but you'll find the definition you've written has… well.. other ideas.  :)
17:19 zNowkid_: (drop '(1 2 3 4 5) 0) -> '(1 2 3 4 5)
17:19 dyoo: Yup, so your base case is probably correct.
17:20 dyoo: Now do the simplest non-base case: when you're dropping a single element.
17:20 dyoo: Use the stepper if necessary to see where your definition is deviating from what it should be.
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17:22 zNowkid_: for a single element i should get (2 3 4 5) instead i get '(2 3 4 5 2 3 4 5)
17:22 dyoo: Isn't that strange?  :)
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17:23 dyoo: Yeah, so look back at the body of your defintion, and see which parts contribute to what.  You should see where the problem is.
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17:28 zNowkid_: this did the trick
17:28 zNowkid_: (drop (cdr L) (- n 1))
17:28 zNowkid_: :P
17:28 dyoo: yeah, right?  :)
17:29 dyoo: lesson: when you're debugging this sort of stuff, try to test the simplest inputs.  You tried attacking from 5, but it's a lot easier to start from 0 or 1.  And make sure to write the test cases out.
17:30 asumu: zNowkid_: are you Dan Grossman's coursera course by any chance?
17:31 zNowkid_: thank you :P. now I can do the mergesort too.
17:32 zNowkid_: asumu: no. but I did sign up there.
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17:33 asumu: Sorry, I forgot an "in" in that sentence.
17:33 dyoo: a situation that typed racket probably might have helped.  :p
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17:36 asumu: Hehe: https://twitter.com/fogus/status/303976660712181760
17:36 dyoo: Cute.
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18:49 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/gIoPBA
18:49 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 0afcda2 Matthew Flatt: fix error checking for `flreal-part' and `flimag-part'
18:49 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 97c3490 Matthew Flatt: racket/extflonum: fix JIT-inlined `extflvector-ref' in 32-bit mode
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19:07 clements_: any redex folks on?
19:10 asumu: clements_: I've used redex, if that counts.
19:11 clements_: asumu: I'm just trying to make redex automatically generate terms that satisfy things defined with define-relation.  I think I can artificially wrap it in a metafunction to make things work, but I'm wondering if I'm missing something obvious.
19:11 asumu: Ah, doesn't it have a function for that now in 5.3.3?
19:12 clements_: There's a clause in "generate-term" that seems like it should work, but I'm getting errors. The examples in the manual all use metafunctions rather than things defined with define-relation.
19:13 asumu: So using #:source with a relation breaks?
19:13 asumu: It sounds like that only means a reduction relation, not a `define-relation` relation.
19:14 clements_: yes, for (generate-term #:source lifetime-< 5) I get "lifetime-<: illegal use of syntax in: lifetime-<"
19:14 clements_: ha! I think I just also found a (very minor) bug w.r.t. metafunctions....
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19:33 lewis1711: thanks asumu (I dunno if they link I had was broken or it's mysteriously started working)
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19:43 asumu: lewis1711: NP. It was mirrored in a few places, so maybe one broke.
19:50 jaimef: is htdp the best reference for mastering racket/scheme?
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19:54 asumu: jaimef: HtDP is a good way to learn programming in general. For Racket, the Guide is probably the best way.
19:54 asumu: (until Realm of Racket is released, anyway)
19:54 jaimef: ok thanks
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20:04 jaimef: is there anyway to use racket like guile to extend a large c application with repl etc?
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20:17 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/LCnlYw
20:17 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 5350720 Matthew Flatt: fix non-extflonum build
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20:19 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/jeEgKA
20:19 RacketCommitBot: racket/master c6f106d Robby Findler: remove spurious printf
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23:09 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/tmahaQ
23:09 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 2f50cde Robby Findler: signal error when attempting to generate from a...
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23:17 dyoo: jaimef: re: embedding in a C program: have you looked at http://docs.racket-lang.org/inside/index.html yet?
23:19 dyoo: jaimef: you can take a look at: http://docs.racket-lang.org/inside/overview.html#%28part._embedding%29 for the specifics, though I have to admit that I haven't tried this myself yet.
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