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01:09 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 3 new commits to master: http://git.io/ujDxnA
01:09 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 17e419e chrdimo: support for multiple blame parties
01:09 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 5231e15 chrdimo: renaming unstable/contract's  option/c to maybe/c
01:09 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 5808b0c chrdimo: adding option contracts in unstable
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01:36 ambrosebs: If anyone's interested, here's my Typed Clojure talk at Clojure Conj 2012 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNhK8t3uLJU
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06:13 bremner: mithos28: it's invalid because my DrRacket environment already had that collects tree in the path.
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08:29 soegaard: This wins the prize for obfuscated code: https://github.com/plt/racket/blob/master/collects/algol60/bd-tool.rkt
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10:23 bremner: I guess there is currently no way to have a ragg grammar as a submodule?
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11:06 stamourv: ASau: Sorry for the late response, I was out for the weekend.
11:06 stamourv: ASau: It looks like you're running `quiet.rktl', if you want more verbose output, run `all.rktl'.
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11:06 stamourv: Or the specific test file you're interested in.
11:07 stamourv: Also, you may want to mention it on the mailing list. Matthew is not on IRC, and he's the one who is most likely to know how to fix it.
11:13 stamourv: ambrosebs: Cool! I'll watch it tonight.
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11:31 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/_QXVOA
11:31 RacketCommitBot: racket/master c8bee5a Robby Findler: disable a broken responsiveness optimization
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12:03 mhr: I'm using http://cs.brown.edu/courses/cs173/2012/book/index.html, and on http://cs.brown.edu/courses/cs173/2012/book/Introduction.html, it says you can use #lang plai-typed...but it didn't work for me.  I'm on a vmware cinnarch os, so maybe that's it...I downloaded racket by using "sudo pacman -S racket".  #lang plai works, though the first example in the book doesn't work under that mode.
12:04 mithos28: what does racket --version say?
12:04 mhr: oh I ought to check, hang on
12:04 mhr: "Welcome to Racket v5.3.1."
12:05 mhr: am I using the wrong version...?  the book was written in november 2012, so I can't see how their racket is different from my racket.
12:07 mithos28: http://cs.brown.edu/courses/cs173/2012/lang/
12:07 (nick) tilde` -> disapprovo
12:07 mhr: ah thanks
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12:13 mhr: awesome, it worked
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12:24 dyoo: bremner: no, sorry, I didn't get to add the ragg submodule stuff that mye requested earlier.  I did write it as issue https://github.com/dyoo/ragg/issues/8
12:25 dyoo: I don't think it'd be too hard.  It just might take a little more time than I have right now.
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12:57 bremner: dyoo: sure, no problem.
12:58 dyoo: bremner: actually, looking into it now.  Maybe it's not difficult at all.  Give me a few minutes.. :)
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14:28 dyoo: bremner: if you're there, would you be interested in playing with the submodule stuff?
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14:34 bremner: dyoo: very much so.
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14:34 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 5 new commits to release: http://git.io/KMq-Lg
14:34 RacketCommitBot: racket/release a0ac38d Philippe Meunier: update, plus some typos and punctuation fixed...
14:34 RacketCommitBot: racket/release f640c2c Robby Findler: only when when there is something to undo...
14:34 RacketCommitBot: racket/release df6eb1b Robby Findler: fix a bug in executable creation...
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14:35 dyoo: bremner: give me sec; pushing updates to PLaneT2 in a moment…
14:36 bremner: fwiw I've just been pulling from git
14:36 dyoo: bremner: but essentially, you will be able to say: https://gist.github.com/4658351
14:36 dyoo: bremner: ah, in that case, switch to the sexp branch
14:37 dyoo: This is all completely undocumented; I just started hacking this as soon as you asked.  :)  I needed to kludge a few things.  In particular, since I'm using the default reader, instead of "|", you need to use "||".
14:37 bremner: ah, right.
14:38 bremner: so bd250a8 is recent enough?
14:38 dyoo: yup, that should be right
14:39 dyoo: So effectively, submodules with ragg/sexp/lang will do it
14:40 bremner: is not needed a lexer a sideeffect of using the default reader?
14:40 dyoo: yeah, though if you look, I'm doing some really evil hackery.  See the contents of:
14:41 dyoo: https://github.com/dyoo/ragg/blob/sexp/ragg/sexp/stx-to-tokens.rkt
14:41 dyoo: where I'm running through the plain syntax object and turning it back into a token stream… :)
14:41 dyoo: basically, I'm letting racket parse it, unparse it, and parse it again...
14:43 stamourv: dyoo: That sounds non-optimal.
14:43 bremner: dyoo: well, I got your example to work. Let's see if I can get something else to work.
14:44 dyoo: stamourv: understatement.  :)
14:53 dyoo: stamourv: The problem I'm hitting is wanting to write submodules whose syntax isn't truly s-exp based.  The hack I'm doing in ragg is, well, not right, but I dont' know what else to do yet.
14:54 stamourv: Oh, right. I remember that discussion.
14:54 dyoo: stamourv: which discussion?
14:55 stamourv: About readers and submodules.
14:55 stamourv: Let me find the link.
14:55 dyoo: stamourv: ah, so this was talked about earlier then!  Thanks, that would be great.
14:57 bremner: dyoo: would you expect this to work: http://paste.debian.net/229783/ ?
14:57 dyoo: huh, that should work.  Trying it out.
14:57 bremner: oops. let me fix that a bit.
14:58 dyoo: bremner: oh, you'll want to break up bark bark "." into separate pieces
14:58 dyoo: eg: (grammar1:parse (list "bark"  "bark" "."))
14:59 bremner: right. OK.
14:59 bremner: yup. that works.
15:00 dyoo: I love it.  It's like the larson comic.
15:01 bremner: I have a more complicated grammar involving growling, slobbering, wagging, and biting.
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15:03 stamourv: dyoo: Sorry, can't find it.
15:03 dyoo: stamourv: no problem.  will ask the mailing list later.
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15:05 bremner: dyoo: here is an updated example, with muliple parsers: http://paste.debian.net/229785/
15:08 dyoo: bremner: awesome.  I'm glad it's working!
15:09 dented42: can I write a macro that prevents one (or more) of it's subforms from being expanded by some of my other macros?
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15:09 dyoo: dented42: can you do a controlled form of expansion with local-expand then?
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15:14 soegaard: dented42: Do you have an example?
15:14 dented42: I'm writing a module language and would like to have some kind of escape-to-racket macro whose body isn't expanded by my other language macros.
15:14 jonrafkind: dented42, you have your own macro system?
15:15 dented42: jonrafkind: what do you mean?
15:15 jonrafkind: i thought you had your own language with its own macro expander
15:15 soegaard: Do your macros return syntax objects immediately or do you fully expand the input?
15:16 jonrafkind: but i guess you're saying that you just want to be able to write racket expressions that dont use the macros from your own language
15:16 jonrafkind: you can always do (require prefix-in racket: some-racket-library) and then use the racket bindings instead of your own
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15:21 dented42: yes
15:21 dented42: they are just racket macros that return syntax objects.
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15:26 soegaard: I think, I need to see a code example. The racket macro expander sees no difference between your macros and "racket expressions". Most constructs in Rackets are macros themselves.
15:26 soegaard: I bet there is another way to accomplish what you want.
15:30 dented42: I suppose what I want is to do is specify the bindings of the escape-to-racket so that it's body is expanded/evaluated in a different module. For example, my module language exports + as something different from racket's + operator, but when using my language I'd like to be able to go (escape-to-racket (print (+ 1 1))) and have it print '2' as opposed to what it would otherwise do, in thise case '#<procedure>'
15:31 jonrafkind: so you can require + as racket:+ and use that instead
15:31 jonrafkind: and racket:print
15:32 soegaard: rudybot: (require (prefix-in racket: racket))
15:32 rudybot: soegaard: your sandbox is ready
15:32 rudybot: soegaard: Done.
15:32 soegaard: rudybot: (racket:+ 1 2)
15:32 rudybot: soegaard: ; Value: 3
15:45 dented42: hm, I suppose that could work.
15:45 dented42: though I was hoping to maintain a cleaner separation between racket and my language
15:47 bremner: dyoo: I was playing a bit more, and it isn't really any harder to use a simple lexer: http://paste.debian.net/229804/
15:48 bremner: string->token-list just wrappers lexer from parser-tools/lex
15:49 bremner: dyoo: thanks by the way, this looks pretty useful for demos already.
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15:55 dyoo: oh, cool.  I didn't know about string->token-list
15:57 bremner: oh, I just wrote it.
15:57 bremner: it's kindof bad racket, but there it is: http://paste.debian.net/229807/
15:58 dyoo: bremner.  Ah.  I see.
15:58 bremner: and the name is much to generic given I hardcoded things into it. But it could be generalized.
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16:01 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 13ff588 Eric Dobson: Do not update subtype and resolve caches when subtyping....
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16:06 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/gPofLw
16:06 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 3c02bb1 Eric Dobson: Type check with expected type when checking recursive loops....
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16:31 dented42: how can a submodule require it's enclosing module? The guide says that it is possible, but doesn't give any details. I would have thought that (require (submod "..")) would do the trick, but it doesn't work.
16:31 stamourv: dented42: You can use `module*' or `module+'.
16:31 dented42: I am using module*
16:32 stamourv: Then bindings from the enclosing module should be available.
16:32 stamourv: They're not?
16:32 dented42: nope, racket complains that it is an unbound identifier
16:33 dyoo: dented42: example: https://gist.github.com/4659253
16:34 dented42: oh!
16:34 dyoo: Very useful if you want to make sure to test the externals rather than the internals.
16:34 dented42: silly me, I didn't do the provide.
16:34 dyoo: :)
16:34 dented42: thanks ^_^
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19:23 flying_rhino: hello guys
19:23 flying_rhino: ever heard of Nemerle ?
19:27 bremner: not I.
19:28 Fare: the name rings a bell. Another ML variant?
19:28 (quit) francisl: Quit: francisl
19:30 jonrafkind: ive heard of nemerle
19:33 (quit) mithos28: Quit: mithos28
19:35 flying_rhino: it should be called nemerle: the best damn language http://nemerle.org/About/
19:36 flying_rhino: it combines all the best stull of C#, lisp and ocaml. It has macros, mutable and immutalbe types, imperative programming, functional programming. You also get to chosse between python and c-like syntax.
19:36 flying_rhino: *stuff
19:36 flying_rhino: it is .net language
19:37 flying_rhino: anyeay I am going
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19:37 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 4 new commits to master: http://git.io/YA6m2w
19:37 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 5348a4d chrdimo: fixing docs and tests for maybe/c (old option/c)
19:37 RacketCommitBot: racket/master b008103 chrdimo: fixing backwards compatibility problems for blame-positive and blame-negative
19:37 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 7223c50 chrdimo: adding docs entry for blame update
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19:44 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/R-Kr2Q
19:44 RacketCommitBot: racket/master aed3b39 Neil Toronto: Added `flexp2', `fllog2', `fllogb'; refactored and documented flonum testing...
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19:55 dented42: flying_rhino, not all the best bits from lisp. they forgot the syntax.
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20:17 Fare: how does it compare to F# ?
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20:19 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/2Ib_vw
20:19 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 17b8092 Michael Filonenko: extflonums...
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20:48 ijp: I'm guessing flying_rhino has a vested interest in it, because otherwise his behaviour makes no sense
20:49 flying_rhino: ijp: I don't have vested interest I just discovered it and got seriously impressed.
20:49 flying_rhino: ijp: they managed to cram a lot of relly good features
20:49 ijp: well, you came on for 10 minutes, said "hey isn't it cool", then said you were leaving...
20:49 flying_rhino: something unexpected come up
20:50 flying_rhino: *came up
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20:50 flying_rhino: but yeah I am easy excitable type
20:50 jonrafkind: yes its unfortunate that its based on .net
20:50 flying_rhino: jonrafkind: well there is always mono
20:51 flying_rhino: so it is actualy rather free,
20:51 jonrafkind: i have yet to have a good experience with mono
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20:52 flying_rhino: dented42: well s-expressions would be better for macros, true. But I prefer python-like otherwise.
20:52 jonrafkind: also i tried nemerle a while ago and couldnt get it to work
20:52 jonrafkind: (in linux)
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20:53 dented42: eh, after playing around a while I've fallen in love with s-expressions. Not just for macros, mind you. They are just so…
20:53 dented42: clean
20:53 flying_rhino: dented42: agreed. Still python-lke is very relaxing. No clutter
20:54 dented42: of course, my love of s-expressions might be my minds way of recovering from the trauma of having a friend try to show me perl. so it could just be a coping mechanism ;)
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21:23 asumu: Nemerle does seem nice, but isn't its macro system limited to the expressiveness of syntax-rules style macros? My impression was that it lacked procedural macros.
21:23 asumu: But I could be wrong.
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22:43 jonrafkind: it has procedural macros
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