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00:42 ararara: What support does racket have for doc strings? I am finding a few things about people trying to implement them in the mailing list, the projects don't seem to exist anymore.
00:44 ararara: I'm basically looking for a way to verbosely comment my code, and thought that docstrings may be the way to do it.
00:45 ararara: At the moment though, because there doesn't seem to be anything standard, I'm thinking about just writing doxgen style comments.
00:45 eli: jonrafkind: ping
00:46 eli: ararara: See scribble.
00:47 ararara: eli: at a glance it looked like it was for writing documentation in seperate files, not inline documentation. Would I be wrong?
00:47 ararara: If so, ill go back and have a proper look.
00:48 eli: ararara: Yes, that's the usual use, although there is literate programming extension for it too -- but writing documentation in a separate file really works better.
00:49 eli: Also, neilv is writing an in-code kind of thing, but I don't know how far it is from being public-able.
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00:52 ararara: Thanks eli, I'll have a look into scribble then.
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02:20 jonrafkind: eli, whats up
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04:25 tomodo: hi
04:26 tomodo: Here's a screenshot of the racket toolbar
04:26 tomodo: http://i.imgur.com/0ApdG.png
04:26 tomodo: the menu is missing and when I click it they sort of show up, but it's broken
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04:32 neilv: tomodo: http://www.google.com/search?q=racket%20bug%20menu%20bar
04:32 neilv: tomodo: if none of the first few hits sounds like your problem, i suggest filing a bug using drracket or by posting to the users@ email list
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04:46 tomodo: any idea how to fix it
04:47 neilv: i'm not familiar with the problem. i just recall hearing of things that sounded similar
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04:59 Kaylin waves.
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05:33 tomodo: make install gets stuck on raco setup: 1 making: macro-debugger
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05:38 tomodo: wait a sec, it finally did it
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05:46 tomodo: compiling racket made my computer turn itself off
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05:46 tomodo: it puts CPU usage up to 100% for a long time
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08:03 neilv: would be nice to have a way to raise a syntax error with *multiple* source locations.  so, for example, if two pieces of syntax disagree in some language, you could click to go to either of them
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09:35 samth: neilv: you can already do that
09:36 samth: rudybot: doc raise-syntax-error
09:36 rudybot: samth: your sandbox is ready
09:36 rudybot: samth: http://docs.racket-lang.org/reference/exns.html#(def._((quote._~23~25kernel)._raise-syntax-error))
09:37 samth: rudybot: eval (raise-syntax-error #f "whee" #'here #f (list #'there #'everywhere))
09:37 rudybot: samth: error: #<undefined>:1:32: here: whee in: here
09:39 neilv: ah, i see, the jump to next error highlight thing
09:41 neilv: if you run from command line, the default error handler does not seem to do anything with the extra-sources
09:41 jrslepak: with redex is there a way to get a judgment to have a premise equivalent to some other judgment failing to hold or pattern failing to match? alternatively, is it possible to have list exclusion as a judgment?
09:45 samth: neilv: yes, the command line doesn't do much
09:46 samth: try it in drracket -- it highlights all the bits
09:46 samth: jrslepak: use a side condition, the `not' function, and `redex-match' or `judgement-holds'
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09:47 jrslepak: samth: it allows side-condition?
09:47 samth: jrslepak: yes, in lots of places
09:47 samth: wait, maybe not in judgments
09:48 jrslepak: judgments seem to the one place it doesn't allow them
09:48 samth: `define-judgment-form' looks like it supports side-conditions to me
09:48 samth: http://pre.racket-lang.org/docs/html/redex/The_Redex_Reference.html?q=judgment-form#%28form._%28%28lib._redex/reduction-semantics..rkt%29._define-judgment-form%29%29
09:48 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/86omuq8
09:50 jrslepak: will I have to download a newer build? the main docs page has no side-condition
09:50 jrslepak: http://docs.racket-lang.org/redex/Other_Relations.html#(form._((lib._redex/reduction-semantics..rkt)._define-judgment-form))
09:51 samth: jrslepak: maybe yet
09:51 samth: maybe yes
09:51 samth: jrslepak: you can can always do (where #f ,(judgement-holds ...))
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09:54 jrslepak: it says it doesn't like unquote in judgments
09:55 jrslepak: I'll just grab the nightly build
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10:02 jrslepak: nightly build still says, "define-judgment-form: expected judgment form name in: side-condition"
10:03 Sicp: is this not the way to attach a text% to an editor-canvas% that's attached to a frame% ? http://pastebin.com/Ah5iQbwC
10:03 Sicp: if I remove the myText block, the editor-canvas shows and it's white and all is fine, but attaching the text% to it is..well it isn't correct
10:03 samth: jrslepak: weird
10:04 Sicp: and I didn't see any callbacks in the reference, so I supposed that this is the way to define it and be done with
10:08 jrslepak: wait, looks like it opened in the wrong DrRacket
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10:13 Sicp: any idea?
10:13 samth: Sicp: sorry, i haven't done much stuff with editors
10:13 samth: you might ask on the mailing list
10:13 Sicp: seems like very few have experience with this particular class
10:14 samth: Sicp: very few here on irc
10:14 samth: like i said, ask on the list
10:14 Sicp: alright sam
10:18 jrslepak: samth: neither of these seem to work the way I'd expected --  http://pastebin.com/Du4WjEY5
10:18 jrslepak: (lines 22, 23)
10:19 samth: jrslepak, right, that won't work
10:19 samth: have you read the docs about side-condition in judgments?
10:20 samth: the body of a side-condition is implicitly quoted there
10:20 samth: unlike in metafunctions etc
10:20 jrslepak: hm
10:20 Sicp: this is it, samth http://pastebin.com/u4JQV1yi
10:20 samth: (side-condition E) is equivalent to (where #t E)
10:20 Sicp: courtesy of rapacity
10:20 Sicp: it's the [editor] field
10:21 Sicp: in editor-canvas%
10:25 jrslepak: samth: still not sure what the trouble is with the (where #f ...) version
10:25 samth: judgement-holds is a racket form, not a redex form
10:26 samth: it's like `apply-reduction-relation'
10:27 jrslepak: (where #t (different x_0 x_1)) appears to work
10:31 jrslepak: samth: thanks for pointing out the new feature :-)
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12:34 zussitarze: Hi.  Recently I had to evaluate Scala for a project, as it's the 'next big thing'.   While the Scala team have done an excellent job overall, I couldn't help but keep thinking, "but... Racket has this too!"
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12:39 bremner: I guess JVM is either a mandatory feature, or not.
12:41 asumu: zussitarze: Good to hear. Anything they have that Racket needs? :)
12:41 zussitarze: asumu: Libraries, libraries, libraries.
12:41 bremner: also, I guess some people find the scala syntax more comfortable.
12:43 zussitarze: bremner: It does have it's advantages, as a battle tested platform.  As for the syntax, I suppose so, but it does have some rough edges.
12:44 bremner: yeah, I found it a bit ad hoc when I glanced at it (compared to haskell)
12:44 zussitarze: asumu: Let me be a bit more specific on libraries.
12:44 zussitarze: bremner: agreed.
12:45 zussitarze: The first question I've noticed when brining up a new language or 'technology' to a dev team is, "Who else uses it?"
12:47 zussitarze: *bringing.  It's really an extension of 'no one ever got fired for buying IBM'.
12:48 zussitarze: Then the question shifts to 'production quality' database drivers, and web frameworks.
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12:52 zussitarze: Then the conversation transitions into benchmarks for the aforementioned libraries.   Choosing a tech infrastructure is a complex affair, and devs will always try to make it as deterministic as possible.  "Are their nice charts that prove I made a good choice?"
12:52 zussitarze: *there.
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15:32 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/K_ciAA
15:32 RacketCommitBot: [racket/master] revert the logo to the released one - Robby Findler
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18:01 bluephoenix47: I'm trying to formalize a language in Redex which has contexts, like Gamma ::= \cdot | Gamma,x:t. Is there a good way to use them in reduction-relations without all kinds of side-conditions?
18:12 asumu: bluephoenix47: If you're trying to do a type system, it might be easier with define-judgment-form.
18:12 asumu: Rather than reduction-relations.
18:16 bluephoenix47: I'm not doing a type system; just using that as an example. I have a rather hairy judgment with contexts containing channels, and information associated with them. When reducing terms, I need to check that a channel is in the context, and match on the information associated with them. The contexts look like (G ((ch tag time) ...) in the langauge definition.
18:17 bluephoenix47: s/...)/...))/
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19:03 asumu: bluephoenix47: It may be easiest to encode that in your evaluation context then.
19:03 asumu: And have the rule trigger based on the shape of your context.
19:03 asumu: e.g., do a non-deterministic match on the (G ...) in the rule
19:03 asumu: (or as a where clause)
19:04 asumu: though maybe that's what you're doing already. I'm not sure there's a better way.
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19:13 bluephoenix47: asumu: Right, it's in the evaluation context, but what do you mean a non-deterministic match on (G ...)? Right now, I just match G, then as a side condition specify (member (term (ch idle time)) (term G)).
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20:21 asumu: bluephoenix47: Something like (G ((ch_0 tag_0 time_0) ... (ch tag time) ... (ch_1 tag_1 time_1) ...)) where you're matching on the middle term.
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20:24 bluephoenix47: asumu: Ahh I didn't realized I could do that. That'll clean some things up; thanks!
20:26 asumu: bluephoenix47: NP. :)
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23:41 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/fYn8Qg
23:41 RacketCommitBot: [racket/master] single-flonum? is not provided by TR's internals anymore. - Vincent St-Amour
23:41 RacketCommitBot: [racket/master] Add typed for missing finum/flonum conversions. - Vincent St-Amour
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