00:00 lewis1711: (require srfi/43), (vector-fold + 0 '#(1 2 3)), => 9
00:00 lewis1711: where it should clearly be 6. looks like it's a very old reference implementation bug
00:00 lewis1711: http://srfi.schemers.org/srfi-43/post-mail-archive/msg00006.html
00:00 lewis1711: not sure if that counts as a racket bug though
00:05 jonrafkind: uh well if chongkai ported it to plt I don't see why that bug would still exist..
00:05 jonrafkind: i mean yes i tested it and its there
00:06 lewis1711: so you have the bug on your machine?
00:06 jonrafkind: yea
00:06 lewis1711: I'm checking other schemes out of curiosity now
00:07 jonrafkind: this code is nutty
00:07 jonrafkind: well his email doesn't match up to srfi/43
00:11 lewis1711: this is possibly my first contribution to computer science. brb, calling my mother.
00:12 jonrafkind: (define (my-vector-fold function base vector)
00:12 jonrafkind: (for/fold ([base base])
00:12 jonrafkind: ([element (in-vector vector)])
00:12 jonrafkind: (function base element)))
00:12 jonrafkind: this seems to work
00:12 jonrafkind: (my-vector-fold + 0 '#(1 2 3))
00:13 jonrafkind: oh yea offby1 already did that in #scheme
00:13 offby1: puzz ling
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00:23 jonrafkind: rudybot: (let ([my-plus (lambda (xx a b) (+ a b))]) (vector-fold-right + 0 '#(1 2 3)))
00:23 rudybot: jonrafkind: your sandbox is ready
00:23 rudybot: jonrafkind: error: reference to an identifier before its definition: vector-fold-right in module: 'program
00:23 jonrafkind: rudybot: (begin (require srfi/43) (let ([my-plus (lambda (xx a b) (+ a b))]) (vector-fold-right + 0 '#(1 2 3))))
00:23 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; Value: 9
00:23 jonrafkind: fffffff
00:24 jonrafkind: rudybot: (begin (require srfi/43) (let ([my-plus (lambda (xx a b) (+ a b))]) (vector-fold-right my-plus 0 '#(1 2 3))))
00:24 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; Value: 6
00:39 lewis1711: jonrafkind: should I submit a bug for this?
00:39 jonrafkind: no
00:40 jonrafkind: did you understand what I just said?
00:40 jonrafkind: sorry i said it in #scheme, but displayed it here
00:40 jonrafkind: i mean dispalyed the code
00:41 lewis1711: that it's a bug in vector-fold-left/
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00:41 jonrafkind: no its by design
00:41 jonrafkind: i mean the design is whacky, but so be it
00:41 jonrafkind: wait fold-left or fold-right?
00:41 lewis1711: fold-right sorry
00:42 lewis1711: I do not get the design of this bug at all then
00:42 lewis1711: or, this feature
00:42 jonrafkind: The fundamental vector iterator. Kons is iterated over each index in all of the vectors, stopping at the end of the shortest; kons is applied as (kons i state (vector-ref vec1 i) (vector-ref vec2 i) ···) where state is the current state value — the current state value begins with knil, and becomes whatever kons returned at the respective iteration —, and i is the current index.
00:42 jonrafkind: i guess vectors are seen as special things where you actually care about the index
00:43 jonrafkind: and lists are just generic container objects that people don't usually care about the index normally
00:43 jonrafkind: but honestly if you are using racket you should use the for forms instead of messing around with fold-left/right
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00:44 lewis1711: well that doesn't make any sense to me at all. also foldl/foldr are much shorter. what's wrong with them?
00:45 DT``: lewis1711, +1.
00:45 DT``: (also, good morning)
00:47 jonrafkind: they work on lists
00:48 lewis1711: rudybot: (require (srfi/43)) (vector-fold + -3 '#(1 2 3))
00:48 rudybot: lewis1711: I would use vector-fold but no such function exists.
00:49 lewis1711: rudybot: (require (srfi/43))
00:49 rudybot: lewis1711: error: eval:1:9: srfi/43: not a require sub-form in: (srfi/43)
00:49 lewis1711: jonrafkind: why not the same functions for vectors then? I don't get this philosophy at all
00:50 jonrafkind: I tend to agree, all container objects should implement some iteratable interface, scala and clojure work this way afaik
00:55 lewis1711: this sort of thing bugs me about most functional languages tbh
00:57 jonrafkind: wlel thats what the for forms are good at
00:57 jonrafkind: (for ([x vector/list/anything]) x)
00:57 jonrafkind: you dont need to know vector-fold or map or whatever
00:58 lewis1711: yeah but if I wanted for loops my C++ compiler is over there ;) But I see your point, I could just write my own vector-fold with for forms
00:59 jonrafkind: i dont think theres anything wrong with for forms
00:59 jonrafkind: i mean its not the opposite of functional
00:59 lewis1711: no, but they are at a lower level of abstraction
01:00 jonrafkind: its the same thing, imo
01:00 jonrafkind: having to explicitly iterate through the elements would be a lower level of abstraction
01:01 lewis1711: it's 5 lines vs 1
01:02 jonrafkind: i dont see a lot of value in that argument
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01:07 lewis1711: I'd rather write less lines. I'd also rather these things be built in optimised procedures that things i have to code in myself.
01:07 lewis1711: *rather than things I
01:08 lewis1711: but no functional language does this for arrays that I've tried apart from F# (interesting scala does it)
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05:57 racket: [racket] plt pushed 11 new commits to master: http://bit.ly/q3LQzL
05:57 racket: [racket/master] Implemented struct colored-error-message struct and colored-format - Guillaume Marceau
05:57 racket: [racket/master] Changed the wording of BSL error messages - Guillaume Marceau
05:57 racket: [racket/master] The htdp test suite now checks that the correct error messages are thrown. - Guillaume Marceau
05:57 (part) racket
06:07 ohwow: Hello, guys.
06:07 ohwow: how are you?
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06:22 racket: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://bit.ly/q0cXp8
06:22 racket: [racket/master] Redo some of the ".ss" -> ".rkt" conversion that were undone in the last push. - Eli Barzilay
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08:49 racket: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://bit.ly/oUwARo
08:49 racket: [racket/master] Updated the expected errors messages in the tests to match the new vocab. - Guillaume Marceau
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08:50 racket: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://bit.ly/ppbYKO
08:50 racket: [racket/master] Adds a research paper section to the error message composition guidelines. - Guillaume Marceau
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11:07 racket: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://bit.ly/qQCc5y
11:07 racket: [racket/master] improve a syntax-object resolution cache - Matthew Flatt
11:07 racket: [racket/master] allow lists of pre-content to `decode-content', etc. - Matthew Flatt
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11:13 mithos28: stamourv: ping
11:13 stamourv: mithos28: pong
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11:14 mithos28: I am trying to fix the tests that I just pushed, and was wondering what phase tc/expr should be run from relative to the code that it is typechecking
11:14 samth: oh ugh
11:15 samth: this is the worst part of the TR tests
11:15 mithos28: I'm pretty sure thats why the kernel-struct tests fail
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11:15 stamourv: I'd say +1, but I'm not sure.
11:16 mithos28: ok, thats what I think aswell, and the test suite doesn't follow that
11:17 stamourv: That's why I'm not sure. I don't fully understand how that part of the test suite works.
11:18 mithos28: it runs a macro which constructs a syntax object of the TR code, and then at phase 0 expands it and calls tc/expr on the expanded version
11:19 stamourv: Then I guess it should be at the same phase.
11:19 mithos28: to replicate real TR it should run tc/expr at phase 1
11:21 samth: mithos28: one possibility is that you need to require #%kernel at an additional phase to make the tests work
11:21 samth: in the struct defintion file
11:21 samth: there's a lot of places in the code already where that's necessary
11:22 samth: b/c the tests run at phase 0 and TR runs at phase 1 normally
11:22 mithos28: that would make the tests work yes, but I am wondering if that is the correct course of action since it works fine in real TR without that require
11:23 samth: mithos28: i haven't found a solution for the tests that works sensibly otherwise
11:23 mithos28: Also, this might be related to the problem with not and false?
11:23 samth: but i haven't tried changing it recently
11:23 samth: mithos28: maybe, but I looked into that and it didn't to help with those
11:23 mithos28: what about eval #'(begin-for-syntax (tc/expr #,test))
11:24 samth: it's really hard to get the resulting type
11:24 samth: so that you can compare with the expected type
11:24 mithos28: because the structs are different?
11:25 samth: no, because begin-for-syntax doesn't produce a useful result
11:25 mithos28: ah ok
11:25 samth: b/c it expands to (define-values-for-syntax () (begin foo (values)))
11:26 mithos28: i'll look to see if I can think of a way to get it to work, and if not add the require line
11:27 samth: sadly, the TR tests involve a combination of macros, state, initialization, and other hard-to-test bits
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11:33 mithos28: why is it not possible to evaluate the code that produces the expected type in the eval?
11:34 samth: you want to have rackunit be in control of the check, so that it can give good messages when there's a failure
11:34 samth: otherwise, all failures are basically "expected #t, got #f"
11:35 mithos28: ok, I'll go with the easy solution for now
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11:47 mithos28: samth or stamourv: is it useful for me to change provides to provide/cond-contract?
11:50 stamourv: Well, that would mean more contracts, so potentially easier debugging.
11:50 stamourv: So yes.
11:51 mithos28: ok, that was my reason for adding them.
11:51 stamourv: Now, whether that's a priority, I don't know.
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11:51 mithos28: It will mostly be the ones that I add while debugging
11:52 stamourv: Then keeping them around is a good idea.
11:53 mithos28: Also why is Rep-seq exported as both Rep-seq and Type-seq?
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11:54 stamourv: Not sure. Maybe they were different at some point.
11:54 mithos28: should I try to clean up things I see like that?
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11:55 racket: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://bit.ly/ol0LIG
11:55 racket: [racket/master] cocoa: fix "&" handling in menu-item labels - Matthew Flatt
11:55 racket: [racket/master] git: fix "&" and "_" handling in labels - Matthew Flatt
11:55 (part) racket
11:56 stamourv: Sure.
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13:01 tauntaun: Out of curiosity, is rudybot written in Scheme/Racket, or is it a third-party bot like Eggdrop, etc.?
13:02 tauntaun: (and if written in Scheme, who is the author?)
13:05 (quit) MayDaniel: Read error: Connection reset by peer
13:07 _p4bl0: tauntaun: https://github.com/aakarsh/rudybot
13:08 _p4bl0: tauntaun: (I just googled "rudybot" ;-))
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13:27 stamourv: tauntaun, _p4bl0: Rudybot is written in Racket, and offby1 is its author.
13:28 stamourv: rudybot: source
13:28 rudybot: stamourv: git clone git://github.com/offby1/rudybot.git
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15:39 racket: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://bit.ly/ntx1MY
15:39 racket: [racket/master] Scheme_Place_Object is now under gc control, multiple places can wait on a place channel. - Kevin Tew
15:39 (part) racket
15:42 rapacity: all your base are belong to gc
15:48 DT``: all your places?
15:55 rapacity: yes, that
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16:04 _p4bl0: haha
16:11 danking: Does anyone know if Racket's implementation of yacc, `parser-tools/yacc', produces LALR parsers? Perhaps it produces more general parsers?
16:15 stamourv: danking: I haven't used it, but if it's called yacc, I would assume it uses similar algorithms as yacc.
16:15 stamourv: If you're looking for more general parsers, there's an earley parser in the test suite.
16:18 (quit) anRch: Quit: anRch
16:21 danking: stamourv: Searching the docs for "earley" yields no results. I think it does use LALR because that's what Shivers says in his paper "Lexer and Parser Generators in Scheme," but that paper is a bit old. The Bison docs mention the IELR mode which they claim is as effecient as LALR, but strictly more powerful.
16:22 danking: I was curious whether Racket has added this "IELR" parse table option to their library.
16:22 stamourv: I don't know about IELR.
16:22 stamourv: As for the earley parser, it's part of the benchmark suite, and not an actual library, which is why it's not documented. I don't know how friendly it is to use.
16:23 stamourv: If you're interested: collects/tests/racket/benchmarks/common/earley.sch
16:26 danking: Alright. I'll take a look at that.
16:28 stamourv: As I said, I don't know if it's usable as-is, but it may be a good starting point.
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16:59 racket: [racket] plt pushed 4 new commits to master: http://bit.ly/oSS5l6
16:59 racket: [racket/master] speed up `hash-ref' - Matthew Flatt
16:59 racket: [racket/master] slightly faster method sends - Matthew Flatt
16:59 racket: [racket/master] fix inconsistent version declaration - Matthew Flatt
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17:10 racket: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://bit.ly/nzPdSH
17:10 racket: [racket/master] note an implementation rationale - Matthew Flatt
17:10 racket: [racket/master] fix `unsafe-struct-{ref,set}' for chaperones - Matthew Flatt
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17:28 racket: [racket] plt pushed 3 new commits to master: http://bit.ly/pYm5o1
17:28 racket: [racket/master] Attempting to fix a very brittle test case - Jay McCarthy
17:28 racket: [racket/master] Typo in formlet docs - Jay McCarthy
17:28 racket: [racket/master] Typo in formlet docs - Jay McCarthy
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17:35 racket: [racket] plt pushed 5 new commits to master: http://bit.ly/o2wvLj
17:35 racket: [racket/master] fixed doc typos - Ryan Culpepper
17:35 racket: [racket/master] unstable/gui/ppict: added cascade placer - Ryan Culpepper
17:35 racket: [racket/master] unstable/gui/ppict: added abs-x, abs-y placer args, changed grid to 1-based - Ryan Culpepper
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17:54 racket: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://bit.ly/qN7Dld
17:54 racket: [racket/master] register place async channel wakeup_signal with GC - Matthew Flatt
17:54 racket: [racket/master] reliably clear signal_handle when a place ends - Matthew Flatt
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18:47 racket: [racket] plt pushed 8 new commits to master: http://bit.ly/oCVmOp
18:47 racket: [racket/master] First stab at optimizing bounds checking. - Vincent St-Amour
18:47 racket: [racket/master] Do the impersonator? check up front. - Vincent St-Amour
18:47 racket: [racket/master] Move flvector types with other indexing functions. - Vincent St-Amour
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18:54 racket: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://bit.ly/pckiQP
18:54 racket: [racket/master] Rephrase some of the (meta) wording, reformat, fix some scribble-isms, etc. - Eli Barzilay
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19:27 racket: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://bit.ly/mVSyHh
19:27 racket: [racket/master] fix JIT support for property accessor with failure argument - Matthew Flatt
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19:55 tzhuang: hello, anyone here use racket from command link?
19:55 tzhuang: *command line
20:01 offby1: all the time
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20:06 tzhuang: are there any handy hotkeys i can use
20:06 tzhuang: like autocompletion of filenames or scrolling through commands
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20:12 tzhuang: who here codes racket in vi?
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20:19 tzhuang: i had a colorscheme script working to highlight keywords when coding scheme in vi
20:20 tzhuang: but i just upgraded to racket and obviously the script broke, what do you folks who use vi do to highlight your keywords
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20:23 shofetim: I haven
20:23 shofetim: t
20:24 shofetim: used vi in a long time
20:24 shofetim: but a google search for vim lisp modes
20:24 shofetim: should turn up something. I think there where 3-4 that where quite complete
20:24 shofetim: You might give emacs or DrRacket a once over though...
20:26 Demosthenes: not to start a flamestorm, anyone want to weigh in on racket vs clojure?
20:28 bremner: you tell us?
20:29 shofetim: different tools for different jobs... what do you want to do?
20:29 Demosthenes: i figured asking the experts was i order. love racket though i do, i wonder if a cross platform biz app would be better done in clojure
20:30 shofetim: close intigration with java and lots of potential parallelism = clojure
20:30 shofetim: experimenting / making DSL + general work (and freedom from the JVM) = racket
20:30 shofetim: I would do it in racket
20:30 bugQ: really just depends on whether you're interfacing with legacy java code
20:30 bremner: where does clojure get parralelism?
20:30 Demosthenes: actually, i detest java
20:31 Demosthenes: with a passion, i'll typically avoid it like the plague
20:31 Demosthenes: but, two recent apps made me stop to think about that. Revenge of the Titans (yes, a base defense game, but x-plat in java!), and yEd (diagram editor)
20:31 tzhuang: shofetim: i use DrRacket all the time, but i want t learn vim
20:32 (quit) mithos28: Quit: mithos28
20:32 tzhuang: shofetim: i've kinda sided on the vi side of the vi/emacs war
20:32 tzhuang: shofetim: just starting with vi, no time to learn 2 editors >__>
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20:32 bremner: without knowing vim?
20:33 Demosthenes: learn emacs ;]
20:33 Demosthenes: aside from some favorable app impressions, i hit a snag where i may need to write a short data collection app that runs in windows with a short gui frontend :P
20:33 bugQ: tzhuang: why didn't you say earlier ?  if you're unaffiliated now then break away from tradition
20:33 shofetim: bremner: its my understanding the clojure was designed with parralelism in mind
20:33 shofetim: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clojure
20:34 bugQ: use something crazy like acme
20:34 Demosthenes: on linux i'd use expect and not give it a second thought, but i'd need a self-contained windows binary that does ssh and https :P
20:34 shofetim: or, more strictly, for parralelism/cuncurency
20:34 bugQ: http://www.caerwyn.com/acme/
20:35 tzhuang: acme? o.o
20:36 bugQ: it's a little mouse based but uses it in a powerful way
20:36 bugQ: middle-click can run arbitrary commands based on pattern matching
20:36 Demosthenes: mouse = bad
20:37 (quit) mithos28: Client Quit
20:37 bugQ: also implements a mini tiling window manager
20:37 shofetim: tzhuang: http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=2531
20:37 shofetim: tzhuang: http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=2219
20:37 bugQ: Demosthenes: thus "crazy"
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20:39 tzhuang: wow so much stuff to read
20:39 tzhuang: i'm reading the stuff you guys are linking me, not afk =P
20:40 Demosthenes: tzhuang: so? any real programmers editor will have tons of docs. emacs and vi are the same there
20:40 bremner: ah I seem. Clojure has software transactional memory (STM).
20:40 Demosthenes: but you're in a lisp (scheme) channel, why not run an editor that runs a lisp variant? emacs is just an elisp interpreter posing as an editor
20:40 Demosthenes: bugQ: i use a tiling wm, awesome
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20:42 tzhuang: bugQ: hmm i think i'll stick with learning vim. i know there's a huge community for it. and also not using mouse makes you look more gosu
20:42 Demosthenes: tzhuang: switch to a tiling wm w/o a mouse.
20:43 tzhuang: Demosthenes: whats wm stand for?
20:43 bugQ: window manager
20:44 tzhuang: Demosthenes: could you name me some examples?
20:45 tzhuang: are slimv and limp seem to be for the same purpose, are you supposed to insatll both?
20:46 tzhuang: bugQ: regarding my question in the #scheme channel , how do you make such an install script
20:47 Demosthenes: tzhuang: xmonad, awesomewm come to mind
20:48 bugQ: tzhuang: why do you need one ? there are 4 files, it would take longer to write it than to copy the files
20:49 tzhuang: bugQ: if i have pathogen installed, do i still install it the same way, or put everything in ~/.vim/bundle/
20:52 bugQ: oh I see. yes, it would go in .vim/bundle/vim-racket
20:52 tzhuang: so i download everything and put it as it is in that folder
20:53 bugQ: but your earlier question is more pertinent: each of these vim bundles is a complete racket editing mode, there is no need for more than one.
20:53 bugQ: and something like slimv would indeed be more useful than just syntax recognition
20:54 tzhuang: goign out for a stroll with my dad bbl 20 mins
20:56 Demosthenes: hi dad! be proud, he's learning useful skills!
20:56 Daemmerung wishes he could nip out for a stroll with his Dad....
20:56 Daemmerung: that is awesome.
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21:27 littlebobby: tzhuang, http://jmcpherson.org/editing.html
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21:49 eli: tzhuang: For a better command line support, see http://barzilay.org/misc/interactive.rkt
21:49 eli: (Hopefully it will get added to the main distribution soon, maybe even in time for the coming release.)
21:50 tzhuang: ooo thanks eli
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22:57 tzhuang: eli: wow it's very nice i like i like
22:57 tzhuang: somebody pointed me to limp and slimv earlier
22:57 tzhuang: are those supposed to be used in conjunction with each other
22:57 tzhuang: or separate plugins that achieve the same function
22:58 eli: tzhuang: Like I said, I'm working on getting it into the tree.  (Right now, actually.)
23:00 tzhuang: how come require readline isnt something thats included? seems to be something thats used very often
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23:01 eli: tzhuang: http://docs.racket-lang.org/readline/index.html#(part._.License_.Issues)
23:01 eli: That's why.
23:02 tzhuang: ewww legalities =(
23:02 tzhuang: thats unfortunate
23:03 tzhuang: well i suppose the ~/.racketrc isnt too much of a hastle
23:04 tzhuang: is anyone able to answer my questions regarding slimv and limp
23:05 offby1: .oO("hastle"?)
23:05 offby1: rhymes with Karl Cassel
23:06 Daemmerung: do the hastle!
23:06 (part) yoklov1
23:07 Daemmerung: tzhuang: unfortunately, as a vi user you have chosen the path less traveled
23:08 tzhuang: =P two roads diverged in a yellow road
23:08 (quit) bugQ: Remote host closed the connection
23:08 tzhuang: I took the one less traveled by,
23:09 tzhuang: And that has made all the difference.
23:09 tzhuang: robert frost taught me well
23:09 Daemmerung: Not well enough!
23:09 Daemmerung offers a glowing Emacs
23:09 (join) racket
23:09 racket: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://bit.ly/np1XJ4
23:09 racket: [racket/master] providing a name for tick handler, Closes PR 12027 - Matthias Felleisen
23:09 (part) racket
23:09 tzhuang: aha. maybe when i mess up my systme beyon repair =P
23:10 tzhuang: im pretty new to linux too so thats bound to happen soon
23:10 Daemmerung: Until then, you're going to enjoy many character-building experiences.  Good luck.
23:11 Daemmerung: I think that duncanm (occasional #scheme denizen) used vi.  Look out for him.
23:12 tzhuang: are there ways to add contacts in irssi?
23:12 Daemmerung: I don't know. I'm here in an Emacs buffer, believe it or not.
23:12 eli: jonrafkind is using vi too, and is much more reachable...
23:13 eli is in an Emacs buffer too, obviously
23:13 Daemmerung: all those vi users look the same to me.
23:13 eli: :)
23:14 littlebobby: Daemmerung, you mean they all look like nerds? SURPRISE!
23:14 littlebobby uses vi too
23:14 Daemmerung: NERRRRDDDSSSSSS /Ogre
23:14 eli: I have nothing against vi users, as long as they do the using in the privacy of their homes.  I don't want my kid to see an actual user.
23:14 Daemmerung: Think of the children, please.
23:15 tzhuang: yea i got  lot of help from jonrafkind earlier
23:15 Daemmerung: Many vi users are really decent folk.  It's just a few who give them a bad name.
23:15 littlebobby: Daemmerung, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZEdDMQZaCU hahaha
23:15 Daemmerung: littlebobby: you are a scholar of the classics, I see!
23:16 tzhuang: well im just learning vi, so im beginning to nerd
23:16 Daemmerung: littlebobby just confessed to the nameless affliction as well; perhaps he can be of service
23:16 tzhuang: is there a way to autoupdate software from github
23:17 tzhuang: isnt git a repository program
23:17 littlebobby: tzhuang, have you read that article on "efficient editing" in vim?
23:17 tzhuang: littlebobby: yes i have
23:17 littlebobby: tzhuang, good for you :-)
23:17 tzhuang: littlebobby: i acutally chanced on that article WAAAAY back when i first tried vim
23:18 tzhuang: littlebobby: and gave up soon after (escaped back to the safety of notepad++)
23:18 tzhuang: littlebobby: but yea, reading it now, a lot of the stuff made much more sense
23:18 littlebobby: tzhuang, don't try to learn everything at once, get comfortable with the basics and build upon that. I'm sure from being a vim heavyweight
23:19 littlebobby: tzhuang, yeah, how did that giving up happen? too many things at once?
23:19 tzhuang: tzhuang: well that was years ago when iw as still in high school. and well you know how vim is
23:20 tzhuang: tzhuang: EVERYTHING does SOMETHING
23:20 littlebobby: haha
23:20 tzhuang: o wow im toally messaging myself
23:20 offby1 backs away slowly
23:20 littlebobby: yeah, don't hack at your keyboard like a cat
23:20 tzhuang: littlebobby: but yea, it was very hard to get into it, because i'd never remember what mode iwas in, and then i'd try to undo something
23:20 tzhuang: littlebobby: with c-u obviously (long time windows user)
23:21 littlebobby: tzhuang, well, always hit escape when done editing
23:21 tzhuang: littlebobby: and taht wouldnt work, and i couldnt figure out how to copy and paste. yea was quite a struggle haha
23:21 tzhuang: littlebobby: haha im much more well versed with vi now
23:21 littlebobby: that's muscle memory for me
23:21 littlebobby: okay :_)
23:21 tzhuang: littlebobby: i think im acutally in love with my .vimrc lol.
23:22 tzhuang: littlebobby: was on the vim channel and ppl showed me some really nice remaps
23:22 eli: littlebobby: I was thinking more like http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/248464/hes-become-one-of-them
23:22 littlebobby: hmm, I don't have too much stuff in there. just a little I suppose. the last things I've changed were colorschemes (scrollcolor plugin is good for testing schemes) and changing my font to Liberatino Mono
23:23 littlebobby: oh btw.... daylight
23:23 tzhuang: littlebobby: o. i have like ; mapped to : so i dont mess up with :W or :Q
23:24 tzhuang: littlebobby:  or like. <leader>ev/sv mapped to editing and reloading vimrc
23:24 littlebobby: tzhuang, heh, on the german keyboard ; and : are on seperate keys via shift
23:24 tzhuang: anyywhoo thats totally off topic. need to figure out how to get this racket.vim working
23:24 tzhuang: littlebobby: o reallly? thats crazy
23:25 tzhuang: littlebobby: so it'll be a struggle for you either way then ;D
23:25 littlebobby: tzhuang, http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_2xKZgKYJlJs/S8xnT7LxANI/AAAAAAAAAiY/GArl5dgqRjo/s1600/KeyboardLayout-German.png lower right corner
23:25 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/32nd5ct
23:25 tzhuang: thats terrible
23:25 littlebobby: it's not really a struggle, I've used US-layout for 2 years exclusively but working on a different computer was a hassle
23:26 littlebobby: nah, I'm used to it, I think that makes all the difference
23:26 tzhuang: yea for sure
23:26 littlebobby: also I had my umlauts ä, ö & ü via a modifier, that sucked as well
23:27 tzhuang: are you german?
23:27 littlebobby: jawohl :-)
23:28 littlebobby: <- berlin
23:28 tzhuang: ooo. a lot of gosu german coders out there it seems
23:28 Daemmerung will be there next month
23:28 littlebobby: Daemmerung, interesting :-) holiday?
23:29 Daemmerung: yep.  Berlin to Dresden, on a bicycle.
23:29 littlebobby: wow, nice
23:29 Daemmerung: I have forgotten all of my college German, umlauted nick and surname notwithstanding, so it'll be an adventure.
23:30 littlebobby: I've only recently increased my endurance, starting with cycling (entry-level drug for sure). now jogging was too much burden for my body to do it several times a week so now I started doing HIIT
23:32 Daemmerung: I am a reluctant bicyclist.  It is a concession to middle age.  Chronic ankle injuries from running.
23:32 littlebobby: Daemmerung, do you strike with the heels when running?
23:33 Daemmerung: Anyway, I'm excited to visit middle Europe.  Haven't been in thirty years.  Hopefully the natives will forgive my eccentric vocabulary.
23:33 littlebobby: I've also only recently started running on the balls of the feet...
23:33 Daemmerung: littlebobby: no, I'm a toe-striker.  But that's after the tendonitis set in.
23:33 Daemmerung: Too late for me.  Hope it works for you.
23:34 littlebobby: Daemmerung, wow, nice, that'll be quite the journey after so many years for sure
23:34 littlebobby: damn, I'm really looking forward to the next berlin lispers meetup. should be at the 3rd wednesday again
23:34 littlebobby: (will be my first)
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23:35 littlebobby: lisp really sparked my curiosity like nothing else has for a while, I'm psyched
23:41 littlebobby: Daemmerung, where are you from, btw?
23:44 Daemmerung: littlebobby: Washington State, USA.  DNA is a mix of Deutschland and Dixie.
23:44 littlebobby: :-)
23:45 tzhuang: i was born in china but been in canada for most my life ;o
23:45 Daemmerung: toronto?
23:47 tzhuang: ottawa
23:47 tzhuang: well i was in waterloo for a long time for school
23:49 Daemmerung: I knew a lot of Watpubbers, back in the day.  Still see one or two of them.
23:50 tauntaun has interesting memories of Ottawa...
23:52 tzhuang: haha ottawa is pretty quite, but i love it
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