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02:41 EM03: what does repl mean in a scheme context
03:48 EM03: in racket ....things that are purple are printed out right? and things that are blue are actual values?
03:58 ohwow: REPL = Read Eval Print Loop
03:58 ohwow: means Scheme reads your input, evaluates it, print the result to you
03:58 ohwow: and do it over and over again :)
03:59 ohwow: not sure about this syntax hilighting thing
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04:13 EM03: ohwow: its in the interpreter window
04:13 EM03: in the latest racket
04:13 blomqvist: dr. racket?
04:51 EM03: blomqvist: yes
04:51 EM03: I think real values that are returned are blue
04:52 EM03: and things printed out by functions are purple
04:52 EM03: if I'm wrong please tell me hehe
04:53 blomqvist: EM03, purple is your input, blue is the result
04:54 EM03: what do you mean by input?
04:54 blomqvist: you type in interpreter window
04:54 EM03: I don't think thats correct?
04:54 EM03: (display (display 10))
04:54 EM03: 10#<void>
04:54 EM03: the 10 etc is purple
04:55 EM03: > (define newnum 10)
04:55 EM03: > newnum
04:55 EM03: 10
04:55 EM03: the 10 is blue
04:56 blomqvist: right, printed output (display) is purple, and returned values are blue.
05:10 EM03: yes
05:11 EM03: and void values are not printed out right?
05:11 EM03: err returned
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09:26 EM03: blomqvist: you still up? could you verify that? hehe
09:27 blomqvist: EM03, yes, unless you try to explicitly print them using 'display'
09:27 blomqvist: sorry didn't see you messages
09:30 EM03: yes unless you use display ....but the actual display your calling willl not be printed out as its unspecified ....just the stuff inside of the display will be explicitly printed right?
09:36 EM03: blomqvist: but yea just wanted to get that simple thing right, helps everything make so much sense later :P
09:37 blomqvist: (display "xyz") => "xyz"
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09:50 EM03: blomqvist: yea i know that but the actual void value of display does not get shown
09:50 blomqvist: EM03, right, not unless you use display to print it.
09:51 EM03: the xyz is just printed out correct? i think so
09:51 EM03: display to print the display?
09:51 blomqvist: <EM03>  (display (display 10))
09:51 blomqvist: <EM03> 10#<void>
09:51 EM03: yea
09:51 EM03: that void is the nested display though right? not the outer
09:52 EM03: if so then I am thinking the right way blomqvist  and was correct all along
09:52 blomqvist: right
09:52 bremner_: better to try these things in your own repl if you have doubts
09:53 bremner_: well, maybe it doesn't help so much in this case.
09:53 EM03: well i was just going crazy on why display was not returning void ....
09:54 EM03: which it does if its nested but the most outer one gets supressed or what not whatever you call it
09:55 EM03: the simple things that make everything else just fall into place
09:55 bremner_: try (define foo (display "hello"))
09:55 EM03: but I do understand how annoying these questions are
09:56 bremner_: ah, I wasn't complaining about the questions, don't worry about that.
09:56 EM03: heheh still though, they are annoying, its a very simple question
09:57 EM03: did you mean for that to me (foo) bremner_ ?
09:58 EM03: on the definition it printed out hello but after foo is just a void variable ...
10:00 yoklov: yeah
10:00 EM03: yea to what yoklov ? hehe
10:00 yoklov: because you aren't defining foo to be (display "hello"), you're defining it to be the result of the evaluation of (display "hello")
10:01 EM03: if I do just foo nothing is returned
10:01 yoklov: right.
10:01 yoklov: or
10:01 EM03: if i do (display foo) i get a void
10:01 yoklov: void is
10:01 yoklov: well
10:01 yoklov: try just entering (void)
10:01 yoklov: nothing is returned
10:02 EM03: ah yes
10:03 EM03: so really any way to get the true return of a function is to enclose it in the display right?
10:03 yoklov: er
10:03 EM03: and even then the actual display thats calling all of that, it's void is supressed
10:04 yoklov: i mean
10:04 yoklov: what a function returns is what a function returns, if it returns void it's not printed but thats still what it returns
10:04 EM03: just say yes so I can live in happiness
10:05 yoklov: lol, fine yes.
10:05 EM03: but void is never printed out when doing it in the interpreter right?
10:05 EM03: unless its enclosed with display
10:05 yoklov: http://docs.racket-lang.org/guide/void_undefined.html?q=voi
10:06 yoklov: might help you out
10:06 EM03: but am I correct? hehe hI think I am correct I am just over analyzing
10:06 EM03: I think I'm learning java but im really not :)
10:07 yoklov: well
10:07 yoklov: there are other ways to make it show up i think
10:07 bremner_: EM03: void is just a special constant, like #f
10:07 yoklov: (list (void))
10:07 yoklov: as on that page
10:07 EM03: When the result of an expression is simply #<void>, the REPL does not print anything.
10:08 EM03: what exactly is repl again? i know what it means but what is it? hehe
10:08 yoklov: repl is the >
10:08 yoklov: that you type stuff into
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10:08 yoklov: in dr racket
10:08 yoklov: read eval print loop
10:09 EM03: ah
10:09 EM03: I think i have it now
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10:22 EM03: but for booleans #t and #f are printed to the repl yoklov , i guess void is a special in that regard right?
10:24 ohwow: yes, that's why it's called void
10:25 EM03: cool cool
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13:13 EM03: {"?
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14:30 ray`: any typed racket users around?
14:30 mithos28: ray: yes.
14:31 ray`: (: (List String ... String Number))
14:31 ray`: But works.
14:31 ray`: i.e.  A List of Strings and then a single Number value.
14:33 mithos28: Let me see if I understand your question. The code provided doesn't work but you want a type that provides that?
14:33 ray`: Yes.  The type of a list composed of nary number of b's and then a single a.
14:34 ray`: (list "a" "b" "c" ... 1)
14:34 mithos28: (define-type SN-List (Rec SN-List (U (Pair String SN-List) (List Number))))
14:35 ray`: Ok thx.  Thought about trying Rec but didn't.
14:36 mithos28: no problem.
14:36 ray`: The manual has something like the following which kept me confused.
14:36 ray`: (List t ... trest ... bound)
14:36 ray`: is the type of a list with one element for each of the ts, plus a sequence of elements corresponding to trest, where bound must be an identifier denoting a type variable bound with ....
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14:39 mithos28: That is confusing. I'm not sure exactly what it is trying to say.
14:39 ray`: Neither did I :)
14:40 ray`: Later the ormap example clearly shows the use of a the literal ...
14:41 mithos28: Ok if the second ... is a mistake, I can parse it
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14:41 mithos28: The ... are at the meta level saying repeats, and bound is the literal ... .
14:42 ray`: I was unable to get that syntax in the above (String ... Number) attempt.
14:45 ray`: nor should it.  I need to try a few more tests.  Thx.  Your Rec example is working fine for me.
14:45 mithos28: Ok. Glad I could help.
14:48 ray`: another question.  Given the inverse type of the example (define-type NS-List (Pairof Number (Listof String)))
14:49 ray`: Is it possible to instantiate or apply  "reverse" i.e. How do I get the reverse procedure to be
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14:49 ray`: (: reverse (SN-List -> NS-List))
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14:49 ray`: Given the reverse is defined to be polymorphic in only 'a.
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14:50 mithos28: You cannot make the reverse from racket/base work that way.
14:51 ray`: so I thought.
14:51 mithos28: You could write your own reverse, or you could require/typed it
14:52 mithos28: (require/typed racket (reverse (SN-List -> NS-List)))
14:52 ray`: Ahhh I did not know one could require/typed (override) something which was already typed.
14:54 mithos28: Yep. You can take any untyped function to the typed world.
14:55 ray`: But in #lang typed/racket its typed. But I can always lift from untyped racket and type it for various types of hetrogeneous lists and if necessary alias it.
14:56 ray`: I think typed/racket is just about the best thing I've seen in a programming language in years.
14:57 ray`: I've been converting files of racket code for since last week.
14:59 mithos28: I have had lots of success with it as well.
15:00 mithos28: In my experience there are still a bit of bugs/ rough patches. But they are fixed very quickly.
15:01 ray`: Other then giving extra hints with let: etc and the occasion (inst ... where inferencing didn't get there, so far it's done everything I've asked of it.
15:02 ray`: Rocking start.  One day 1 I got may butt kicked for a few hours failing it to get "sort" to work.  But other then that, pretty smooth.
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15:14 ray`: All seems to work just fine.  https://gist.github.com/960749
15:15 ray`: Except...  Once I define reverse via require/typed I can't use reverse on any other type of list.
15:15 ray`: Does require/typed allow for renaming, prefixing etc.  I want to require/type reverse as "myreverse"
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15:17 ray`: Wait.  Think I figured it out using (module ...)
15:20 mithos28: (require/typed racket ((reverse my-reverse) (SN-List -> NS-List)))
15:20 mithos28: that should work
15:23 ray`: how'd you do that?
15:24 mithos28: I just guessed that it worked that way
15:25 ray`: I don't see it in the doc. (the online)
15:25 mithos28: That is how rename-in and rename-out work
15:26 ray`: Damn your good.  Who is going to win the Kentucky Derby today?
15:26 mithos28: Horse number 4.
15:39 ray` is busy ... on-line with his Grand Caymen bookie.
15:48 ohwow: https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/The_Kentucky_Derby_Is_Decadent_and_Depraved :)
15:48 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/44gzqwm
15:48 ohwow: http://www.predsontheglass.com/2010/04/tribute-to-hst-kentucky-derby-is.html
15:48 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/42eg38b
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16:50 masm: I have just updated racket from 5.1 to 5.1.1 and lost all the planet development links I had configured. Is there a way to recover them?
16:54 mithos28: masm: planet development links are now per version. So links for 5.1.1 and 5.1 can point to different places. Thus the old ones are not automatically updated
16:56 mithos28: masm: what OS are you on?
17:03 masm: Linux.
17:03 masm: Arch Linux.
17:04 masm: Is there a file I can copy? I have something like 30 development links...
17:05 mithos28: There should be.
17:05 masm: I see a file named HARD-LINKS  in  ~/.racket/planet/300.
17:05 mithos28: Right
17:05 mithos28: and a folder 5.1.1?
17:07 mithos28: you should be able to copy the HARD-LINKS file into the 5.1.1 folder and it should work correctly
17:07 masm: Right.
17:07 masm: That worked.
17:07 masm: Thanks.
17:08 mithos28: You might run into problems if you use different versions of racket now though.
17:08 mithos28: Since the bytecode will be compiled for one version and not the other
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17:12 masm: I was having problems already. Removing all compiled directories and recompiling everything solved it, though.
17:12 masm: I'll use just the last version.
17:12 masm: Thanks.
17:26 jonrafkind: here is the next DVCS we can move to! http://www.fossil-scm.org/index.html/doc/trunk/www/fossil-v-git.wiki
17:26 jonrafkind: i cant wait for the fun to start
17:34 bremner_: I can tell from the executive summary that I don't care.
17:34 bremner_: which means it is really a good executive summary I guess.
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19:12 EM03: '/join #smalltalk
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21:07 PLT_Notify: racket: master Robby Findler * 33c848f (4 files in 3 dirs): added current-cache-all?, a parameter that controls the caching strategy ... - http://bit.ly/k2rjk7
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21:18 ray`: Hmmm... While yes I'm far too full of myself, but it is surprising to observe how buggy my code was as I translate it to Typed Racket.
21:18 ray`: Miracle it ever ran at all.
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22:27 jonrafkind: obviously types are useless
22:36 ray`: Utility aside, they are _highly_ infectious.  I've been typing files all day ... barely made a dent.
23:00 eli: ray`: they're not intended to be infectious -- specifically, it should be possible to convert single modules to TR.
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